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To POSIX or not to POSIX

 
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rooprob



Joined: 20 Sep 2016
Posts: 15
Location: Auckland, New Zealand

PostPosted: Mon Feb 20, 2017 1:07 am    Post subject: To POSIX or not to POSIX Reply with quote

Hi there,

I've read with great interest the threads concerning package building, particularly from @t-rexky and @kb7sgi. Well done guys for the *years* of package updates.

I can definitely see a goal being modernizing the library and POSIX support, and several attempts to update the tool chain.

I've been building MIT Kerberos, as I think it's useful, and I haven't found it built anywhere yet.

I've ended fixing up the compile as-i-go, no source changes, just mainly coercing make around the first autoconf configure I ran with the DEFS additions of -D_POSIX_SOURCE=1 [0], or the LIBS -L/mylibs -lnext_posix [1]

[0] I've since learned is the result of cc -posix, and have further learned that it's better not to use it, but that's my question.... (I'm not sure what's actually broken)

[1] This library started off as the libposix.a in the Software archive, but that threw lots of errors (cant remember exact text, I get a Arithmetic error on a cwd test), so I built a bastardisation of the posix.txt email C file in the http://www.nextcomputers.org/NeXTfiles/Software/OPENSTEP/Developer/posix.txt plus some missing putenv from http://www.nextcomputers.org/NeXTfiles/Software/OPENSTEP/Developer/NScompatlib/.

Seems to work, though I may have run out runway on this.

OK so my question: So far so slow, I have built a lot of MIT Kerberos, but as the end draws near, we're starting to get into daemon's needs around waitpid and signal handling things I believe the POSIX support in OpenStep is getting a bit squiffy.

So have there been any HOWTO guides written for navigating the POSIX problems of OpenStep - I haven't yet stumbled upon them if they're in posts in this forum.

I did have to throw in a -DBYTE_ORDER=1 -DBIG_ENDIAN=1 as we invoked arpa/nameser.h processing; I was really just hacking and not understanding the Right Way.

The huge amount of packages that have been built leads me to believe much of what I want to build is possible; I just need to figure out the right path I should be on for POSIX.

Again, many thanks for the huge archive of packages in https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/0B0gDYBETjc4WSENkOWd3aUZFMWc ; plus everything on NextComputers. Thanks Nitro, Rob and everyone else.
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oneNeXT



Joined: 02 Jun 2008
Posts: 134
Location: Europe

PostPosted: Thu Feb 23, 2017 5:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Which release are you working on ?
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rooprob



Joined: 20 Sep 2016
Posts: 15
Location: Auckland, New Zealand

PostPosted: Fri Feb 24, 2017 6:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oops: OpenStep 4.2


I've build m4, autoconf and automake as a starter to putting together my own POSIX library - and learn a bit of automake.

I've built perl5.6.2 without posix support, which has passed a lot of its tests.

I did the perl build because it's configuration script shines lots of lights into the system, so good for learning. Also the perl build from kb7sgi blew up in IO module with lots of missing posix unresolved symbols and I could not find anything on the system or his google drive which might fill the gabs.

The system perl is 5.001 I think and automake required at least 5.004, however not really, and hacking it's configure script to remove the condition works ok. This is an early version of the auto* tools.

So I have a perl without posix built, which obviously doesn't contain any of the IO or POSIX modules.

Anyway - I'm dripping into this as free time allows.
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rjbrown99



Joined: 14 Apr 2007
Posts: 12
Location: Santa Monica, CA

PostPosted: Sun Feb 26, 2017 11:05 pm    Post subject: libnext Reply with quote

Magnus Lindholm created a version of a library called "libnext" which adds Posix support for some of the key missing functions.

Here's a copy, perhaps it would help:
https://s3.amazonaws.com/nextstuff/libnext-20120225.tar.gz
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Rob Blessin Black Hole
Site Admin


Joined: 05 Sep 2006
Posts: 597
Location: Ft. Collins, Colorado

PostPosted: Mon Feb 27, 2017 2:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hello All: Nice work , I'll be happy to upload any old or new packages , compiles , etc to the NeXTcomputers.org archives just pm with drop box links or whatever works best to me.
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303-741-9998 Serving the NeXT Community since 2/9/93
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t-rexky



Joined: 09 Jan 2011
Posts: 272
Location: Snowy Canada

PostPosted: Mon Feb 27, 2017 8:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Before my now two-and-a-half year old son was born, I had intentions of porting NEWLIB to NEXTSTEP and building a replacement system library with modern functions in it. Those would include most of the POSIX functionality. Unfortunately I have zero time now for such "frivolous" activities, but may return to it at some point in the future...
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rooprob



Joined: 20 Sep 2016
Posts: 15
Location: Auckland, New Zealand

PostPosted: Wed Mar 01, 2017 12:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Newlib: great link. Reading.

As for time: Understood. I have (now) a three and half, and one and half. This is now an information gathering exercise and edu history lesson into POSIX.

t-rexky wrote:
Before my now two-and-a-half year old son was born, I had intentions of porting NEWLIB to NEXTSTEP and building a replacement system library with modern functions in it. Those would include most of the POSIX functionality. Unfortunately I have zero time now for such "frivolous" activities, but may return to it at some point in the future...
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t-rexky



Joined: 09 Jan 2011
Posts: 272
Location: Snowy Canada

PostPosted: Wed Mar 01, 2017 10:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Back in the day I did a lot of research on the various available C libraries and Newlib seemed like the best choice: very low weight since it's meant for (today's) embedded systems, very portable and (theoretically) easy to patch into an existing system.

In another thread on here I described my success in porting OS X cctools to NEXTSTEP:

http://www.nextcomputers.org/forums/viewtopic.php?p=20179

This ultimately provides the ability to build NEXTSTEP style shared libraries, which was previously impossible outside of NeXT. This allows creation of new system library with all obsolete functions replaced by Newlib equivalents, while maintaining total compatibility with the current shared system library for the existing software, as I described in here:

http://www.nextcomputers.org/forums/viewtopic.php?t=2980&start=55

Maybe I will have some time to play again once I retire? In the meantime it would be great if someone else could continue the efforts.

As a side note I was also able to create a GCC-4.6.x cross compiler that runs on PPC OS X 10.5 and creates good and working object files. I am unable to get 4.6 to work on m68k and I believe it is because of its insanely huge resource requirement, in the m68k sense.
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rooprob



Joined: 20 Sep 2016
Posts: 15
Location: Auckland, New Zealand

PostPosted: Wed Mar 01, 2017 6:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yup I ve read those posts - thems hard yards, custom gcc builds and all, you're a genius.

What I need to fix for myself in order to be level up to being anywhere near a contributor
- revise my C compilation process, particularly building dylibs
- revise newlib
- comb over my POSIX research to date
- understand where NeXT/OPENStep deviates from BSD4.3 with good appreciation of how that's different to, say late 90s Linux, *bsd.

I don't know if rhapsody should be in there too; a lot of a stretch.

My wife said why: I equated it to like a jigsaw my granddad used to do. Real retirement project, this. Hard to justify for now. We'll see.


t-rexky wrote:


Back in the day I did a lot of research on the various available C libraries and Newlib seemed like the best choice: very low weight since it's meant for (today's) embedded systems, very portable and (theoretically) easy to patch into an existing system.

In another thread on here I described my success in porting OS X cctools to NEXTSTEP:

http://www.nextcomputers.org/forums/viewtopic.php?p=20179

This ultimately provides the ability to build NEXTSTEP style shared libraries, which was previously impossible outside of NeXT. This allows creation of new system library with all obsolete functions replaced by Newlib equivalents, while maintaining total compatibility with the current shared system library for the existing software, as I described in here:

http://www.nextcomputers.org/forums/viewtopic.php?t=2980&start=55

Maybe I will have some time to play again once I retire? In the meantime it would be great if someone else could continue the efforts.

As a side note I was also able to create a GCC-4.6.x cross compiler that runs on PPC OS X 10.5 and creates good and working object files. I am unable to get 4.6 to work on m68k and I believe it is because of its insanely huge resource requirement, in the m68k sense.
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