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netBSD / Gnustep mac 68k

 
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Would you hack on a mac68k netBSD/Gnustep OS?
Yes
78%
 78%  [ 11 ]
No
14%
 14%  [ 2 ]
Only if it partially worked
7%
 7%  [ 1 ]
Total Votes : 14

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mevdev



Joined: 15 Mar 2006
Posts: 16

PostPosted: Wed Mar 22, 2006 12:46 pm    Post subject: netBSD / Gnustep mac 68k Reply with quote

I dream of an OS that runs on the old mac hardware that is current and next-like. I think it was ironic that Jobs chose the 68k processors when there were many chips out there at that time (alpha, mips, sparc, x86, pa-risc, etc).

I remember reading a while back that the original GNU guys just set about replacing all of the components of Sun's OS ( I think it wasn't solaris yet) so that it was all GNU software. I think it would be possible to do with the old next hardware as the openstep spec could be followed and netBSD could be the lower layer and BSD userland.

I wonder how difficult it would be to achieve binary compatibility between the mac 68k and next 68k.


Just a dream. Rolling Eyes
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mevdev



Joined: 15 Mar 2006
Posts: 16

PostPosted: Mon Mar 27, 2006 6:44 am    Post subject: gnustep after a bit of WINE Reply with quote

Well,

I was just thinking about binary compatibility, and came to the thought of WINE. Well, if wine can run windows apps in linux, and also if roms can be run in emulators on any platform, then I believe that with the correct compatiblity 68k next programs should be able to be run on mac 68k boxes with netbsd and a gnustep layer. I think it would take a little tinkering, but this seems really possible.

Perhaps it could even been maintained so that users of mac os x can just click the checkbox and it will cross-compile for 68k machines.


How hard would it be? I have gameboy code being compiled with Xcode. I haven't moved my project from HAM to SGADE, but I definitely have stuff compiling now. (as a side note)

Is it just a script that goes and links the objects with another version of gcc?
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rpangrazio



Joined: 16 Jun 2008
Posts: 29
Location: Cleveland, OH

PostPosted: Fri Jun 12, 2009 12:27 pm    Post subject: Difficulty Reply with quote

I have had similar ideas in the past. Using GNU step to augment either one of the BSDs or even Darwin.

I have never considered doing binary compatibility for NS/OS to GNUStep. I think the difficulty would be very high.

WINE has been in development for several years. It just reached 1.0 with in the last year. NetBSD had been working on Darwin compatibilty for a while, as well as HPUX on the HPPA's. There was even a project called MACE, which tried to be the WINE of the classic Mac OS's.

I think that making a open source system that could run NS/OS programs compile from source shouldn't be too hard. It would be just a matter of translating things like the make files and any other project config files.(I make it sound soo easy.)

I think the guys at GNUStep would like it, get some real world testing of their 'Step compatibility.

I think it would be cool to roll something like COCOATRON in and make is so any OSX app can compile right out of the box.
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eagle



Joined: 29 Mar 2006
Posts: 393

PostPosted: Sun Jun 14, 2009 11:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

What I really want is a m68k emulator that will run in the Intel version of NeXTSTEP or OPENSTEP, so that I can run my old m68k NeXT apps in NS3.3/OS4.2 in VMware on my Intel MacBook Pro.
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rpangrazio



Joined: 16 Jun 2008
Posts: 29
Location: Cleveland, OH

PostPosted: Thu Jun 18, 2009 6:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It should be possible. I know other OS's have done similar things in the past. Classic Mac OS on a PPC. Newer versions of RISC OS do that to allow people to run older 24 bit apps on the newer 32 bit os. I even think SGI did that to allow you to run IRIX/mips based programs on Linux.

The trick is once it starts running the program, having it do calls to the x86 system and libraries and doing a proper translation so it won't cause it to crash.

I would check out QEMU, it has a userland emulation mode that runs individual programs made for different architectures.
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eagle



Joined: 29 Mar 2006
Posts: 393

PostPosted: Thu Jun 18, 2009 8:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

rpangrazio wrote:
It should be possible. I know other OS's have done similar things in the past. Classic Mac OS on a PPC. Newer versions of RISC OS do that to allow people to run older 24 bit apps on the newer 32 bit os. I even think SGI did that to allow you to run IRIX/mips based programs on Linux.

The trick is once it starts running the program, having it do calls to the x86 system and libraries and doing a proper translation so it won't cause it to crash.

I would check out QEMU, it has a userland emulation mode that runs individual programs made for different architectures.


Yeah, I remember about how Apple included that in PPC Mac OS - that feature was there until the very end of OS 9: you could run MacWrite/MacDraw/MacPaint in OS 9 on a latest-gen PowerBook.

I talked with some of the guys running the QEMU project, and they all agreed that it is doable, but nobody seemed interested in actually doing it. Sad
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bheron



Joined: 30 Dec 2008
Posts: 10
Location: Laurel, MD

PostPosted: Fri Sep 18, 2009 8:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
I think it would be cool to roll something like COCOATRON in and make is so any OSX app can compile right out of the box.


This isn't really necessary. GNUstep can already do this. There's actually very little which Cocotron has which GNUstep hasn't already implemented, so there's no need to mix the two.

Gregory Casamento
* GNUstep Chief Maintainer
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