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Using an SD-Card drive image in Previous Emulator

 
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GrafZahl



Joined: 12 Sep 2010
Posts: 25
Location: Germany

PostPosted: Mon May 30, 2016 11:40 am    Post subject: Using an SD-Card drive image in Previous Emulator Reply with quote

Hello,

I maybe have an odd question at hand. I would like to create a dd image of my black hardware setup and use it as hd image for previous. And after installing some stuff I would like to write it back to an SD card and use it on real hardware. Unfortunetly my setup is a little complex and I did not yet succeed in doing so. Has anybody tried something like that with success?

I have a nextstation color turbo with an SCSI to ide adapter and an attached SD card reader with a 4GB SD-Card on the black hardware side. And a Mac with an SD card slot on the other side.

The Nextstep 3.3 installation to the SD card worked fine and I did not partitioned the card using only 2 GB of it. It bootet without complaining.

Then I created an image on the mac using:

sudo dd if=/dev/disk2 of=~/Desktop/blackBoxNS33.dd

and to test if the image worked I wrote it to another SD card using:

sudo dd if=~/Desktop/blackBoxNS33.dd of=/dev/disk2

the resulting SD card booted and workend on next hardware. Since then i experimented with other dd arguments like rdisk2 and block sizes like bs=512b but did not manage to start an image in previous.

I could provide a link to the dd image but it is quite large (1.3GB) even when 7-ziped.


https://img4.picload.org/image/rgiaaial/previous.png


https://picload.org/image/rgiaaiaa/hex.jpg

Thank you very much.
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mikeboss



Joined: 07 Dec 2011
Posts: 365
Location: berne, switzerland

PostPosted: Mon May 30, 2016 1:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

since I am the creator of all the dd-images with the various NeXT system releases, I do have some experience with images and the dd command. I'm also using a Mac most of the time.

rule of thumb: in OS X always use the rdisk* device!

I did not use any special options or values while creating images.

AFAIK all my images are running just fine with Previous... and I also wrote the images back to SD cards (used with SCSI2SD) and/or CF cards (used with Aztec-Monster). I never experienced any problems. maybe the SCSI<->IDE adapter you're using is no good? also, I'd try a smaller SD card (e.g. 1.0 GB). and make sure that the card you're using isn't bigger than 2.0 GB.

regards,
michael
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andreas_g



Joined: 30 Jan 2009
Posts: 413
Location: Austria

PostPosted: Mon May 30, 2016 10:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The disk label seems to be good. But the output "READ: sdcmd bad state: 0" is strange. I already saw this in some cases after resetting Previous.

If you could provide access to the image I would be glad to test it with my setup and see if something is wrong with the image or if there is a bug in Previous.
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GrafZahl



Joined: 12 Sep 2010
Posts: 25
Location: Germany

PostPosted: Tue May 31, 2016 10:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

mikeboss wrote:
since I am the creator of all the dd-images with the various NeXT system releases, I do have some experience with images and the dd command. I'm also using a Mac most of the time.

rule of thumb: in OS X always use the rdisk* device!

I did not use any special options or values while creating images.

AFAIK all my images are running just fine with Previous... and I also wrote the images back to SD cards (used with SCSI2SD) and/or CF cards (used with Aztec-Monster). I never experienced any problems. maybe the SCSI<->IDE adapter you're using is no good? also, I'd try a smaller SD card (e.g. 1.0 GB). and make sure that the card you're using isn't bigger than 2.0 GB.

regards,
michael


Hello Michael,

thank you very much for the hint of using rdisk and smaller sd cards.
I will try this out as soon as I manage to buy some smaller SD cards next weekend. It is good to know that it should work in theory. The SCSI<->IDE adapter may be a problem though...

Thank you also for creating the dd drive images. I have for sure used one if it in previous in the past Very Happy

regards,
Manuel
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GrafZahl



Joined: 12 Sep 2010
Posts: 25
Location: Germany

PostPosted: Tue May 31, 2016 10:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

andreas_g wrote:
The disk label seems to be good. But the output "READ: sdcmd bad state: 0" is strange. I already saw this in some cases after resetting Previous.

If you could provide access to the image I would be glad to test it with my setup and see if something is wrong with the image or if there is a bug in Previous.


Hello Andreas,

Thank you very much for your kind offer and help. I'll upload the sd card image to my dropbox and mail the link to you afterwards. Unfortunatly my upload is very slow and this will take a couple of hours....

regards,

Manuel
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wa2flq



Joined: 18 Dec 2008
Posts: 30
Location: Chicagoland

PostPosted: Wed Jun 01, 2016 5:49 pm    Post subject: Re: Using an SD-Card drive image in Previous Emulator Reply with quote

GrafZahl wrote:


....

https://picload.org/image/rgiaaiaa/hex.jpg

Thank you very much.


When I look at this dump and compare it to a Intel disk image, it looks like it starts at the partition table. The first 35 blocks (512 byte sectors) are not present.

I move raw openstep Intel images between SCSI drives or microSD cards to/from Fusion VM's. I don't see how the first part of the disk would be skipped in this way.


[Somewhere on the list of TODO's is installing Previous.... Rolling Eyes ]

Jerry
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andreas_g



Joined: 30 Jan 2009
Posts: 413
Location: Austria

PostPosted: Thu Jun 02, 2016 4:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Boot sectors and disk labels for Intel-systems and their layout on disks are different from their equivalents on disks for black hardware. The first sectors for black hardware contain the disk label, starting with the label version (in this case dlV3).

The layout and data of boot sectors and disk labels depend on what the Boot-ROM of the systems expects. Therefore on Intel-systems the disk must contain the data in the way that BIOS expects. On NeXT hardware it must make NeXT's proprietary ROM happy.
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wa2flq



Joined: 18 Dec 2008
Posts: 30
Location: Chicagoland

PostPosted: Thu Jun 02, 2016 9:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

andreas_g wrote:
Boot sectors and disk labels for Intel-systems and their layout on disks are different from their equivalents on disks for black hardware...


Thanks Andreas.

I was wondering if that was the case, but was lacking any Black hardware to check it against.

I looked at /NextDeveloper/Headers/bsd/ufs/fs.h but I don't think this was updated on my system for Intel.
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gilles



Joined: 03 Sep 2009
Posts: 117

PostPosted: Mon Oct 10, 2016 7:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

hello,
the problem might be in some sort of added partition table or fake partition in the SD/IDE adapter.
This kind of partition is needed to avoid deletion of the content if the SD card is inserted directly in a device (I had the same problem in lisa context to read in emulator a CF image from an X-Profile hdd emulator).
The easiest path is to use a small SD and only format it with minimal "out of the box" system, then try to match SD sectors with emulator image of a similar size.
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